Touch Pro System - SOTA? Update
1 - 20 of 29 Posts
Joined
·
200 Posts
Hi Phil
I have been told by two separate JLR service centres that SOTA updates are available for Battery and Infotainment on older vehicles and Touch Pro Duos but Telemetrics is not and will require the vehicle to be booked in. I have also been told by the same two service centres the following…
Quote: “We don’t like to update the Telemetrics software as we have to justify the time/Labour cost to head office. We would only update it if there was a fault or issue to the customer with it” End quote.
The phrase “No Software Updates Available” does not actually mean there are no software updates available for your car. It means they are not available via the selected medium.
Hope this is of some help to you.
Joined
·
189 Posts
Brilliant, thanks for the reply. So just to confirm then that TCU is Telematics? In your other thread TCU 16.2 is what is showing on my screen (same as yours) and the current version is TCU 20.2. So Touch-system cars can only get these updated at the Dealers, who don't want to do it?
Joined
·
200 Posts
Yes that’s correct as far as the two JLR Service centres/Dealerships I spoke to. SCM did suggest that dealerships don’t like to do anything that costs them time or money and he was very right before I checked. There was some doubt or uncertainty in both service centres as to whether Telematics (TCU) could be updated via SOTA for PivoPro vehicles which made me think “how can you not be sure if you are doing the updates” hence I rang a second JLR service centre/dealership. It would seem that time and bookings are so tightly controlled at service centres that they really can not fart without permission. Silly really when the tv, banking app, mobile phone, tablet can all be updated by the user without issue or needing to call any one and email. I guess in the future it will be a selling point that you can now “update your telematics without needing to visit a service centre”. Hopefully JLR will think of it before the German manufacturers do because they won’t be getting my business if they don’t.
Mine is at version 19.2, it's going in for a service this week, however it failed 4 weeks ago when it would just not move. Was informed it was a low battery so they charged it. I am sure they charged the TCU battery because the cover was off .
Will make sure they update the software during the service although I just know that this is going to be an uphill battle but one I will relish.
Will make sure they update the software during the service although I just know that this is going to be an uphill battle but one I will relish.
Joined
·
200 Posts
If you get any further information for updates of any kind but especially Telematics I’d be really grateful if you let me know. Thanks Phil
Joined
·
200 Posts
Update: Phil this is worth you reading. It’s from the .com i-pace forum and clearly shows that MY19 cars have had TCU software updates via SOTA. It also shows a few owners have had similar issues and similar experiences finding their software is out of date, dealership experiences and some of the Pros & Cons.
TCU Update Experience
I am new to the forum and trying to understand if fellow members had similar issue as the one I am facing. I Recently purchased a 2019 HSE model. Using Wattcat, I was able to find out my TCU software version was 16.2. Took the car to the dealer to update the software and dealer said they are not...
www.i-paceforum.com
Separately I have also read a few articles by both JLR and non JLR about updating software and the benefits from small range increases to how the batteries function and the battery buffer zones. Obviously the updates are there to fix bugs and make improvements so it’s my opinion that my vehicle should be kept up to date despite some people saying ‘why bother?’.
Joined
·
583 Posts
I visited the dealer to get from 16.2 to 18.2, later 18.2 to 19.2 updated automagically. I had to ask the dealer to push 20.2 OTA, no visit required.
Joined
·
200 Posts
Good morning Maxwell
I have discovered that yes you have to visit the dealer to get updated from 16.2 and many have replied that there has to be a fault or you have to create one for them to want to do the software update… just plain Bonkers! And yes it would seem you are also correct in that after 18.2 you can do it yourself via SOTA updates although others have said this can be done before 18.2 as long as the software is kept up to date on time each time. Also too, some have needed to get the dealership to ‘push’ it to the car… while others needed a good ‘shove’.
If the owner can do it from the car in their own time then no service slot needs to taken up. No JLR dealership has to waste another JLR head office employees time ‘seeking approval’ to do a software update... we don’t ask our bank or mobile phone provider or tv ‘for approval’ to download the software they are creating to improve their products and services. No call or email has to sent by a fed up confused customer and no JLR employee has to waste time answering that call or email. A mechanic or software engineer doesn’t have to pretend to be working on the vehicle (at cost after warranty expiry) while it’s shut down and immobile as it does the software update. Customers don’t have to spend ages thinking they are doing something wrong when it’s says ‘no software update available’ when it’s actually 3 years old in my case (16.2) and the car isn’t actually ‘looking for an update’ at all and will always say ‘no software update available’. JLR employees don’t need to lie and say ‘everything is up to date’ when they know it isn’t. Customers don’t have to drive all the way the dealership (140miles round trip for me…but still a lovely drive) to get the update and waste more of their time and money and energy. So much simpler for everyone involved to do what it was designed to do… SOTA.
…it’s like putting the cart before the horse and then walking the horse backwards just so you can say “everything is fine”.
Imagine paying hundreds of thousands of pounds to create a department to design, build, test, implement and fix software to improve the vehicle and then paying to market, advertise and sell that product and that specific feature only to tell another department in the same company “don’t update the software unless you have too…”.
Imagine an accident happening and it was discovered under investigation by the police and lawyers that “had the software been updated at that time…it’s highly likely the accident would not have happened”. Alternatively imagine finding out that the cause of the accident was because of that specific software update. You can now prevent further accidents happening to others…. Like on the Boeing 737Max.
Imagine selling or not repairing a vehicle knowing a component is faulty on a vehicle (say a TCU for example in this case) but you can only see the time/labour/cost benefit to yourself by not doing it, and not the knock on effect of not making the repair… Alaska Airlines 261.
Imagine getting caught doing stupid things with other peoples property and then the cost of having pay out for lawyers, compensation and then being forced to correct what you should have done (or not done) in the first place and the loss of respect for your product? …Apple iPhone 6 battery software and VW Golf ‘Test deafeat’ software.
…all that for something the customer can do for free from the comfort of their own vehicle in their own time…at no cost to JLR.
If you create the environment where Dealerships don’t want to do anything at all without ‘approval’ from head office, this then leads to a culture of successive software updates not being done to the point that, beyond a certain software update that you haven’t downloaded, you then have to take the vehicle to a service centre and lots of peoples time has to wasted. This leads to service slots being taken up unnecessarily and delays to other customers requiring repairs. You also create the mind set that ‘it’s ok’ to sign off or sell a vehicle that’s is not ‘up to date’. Why wouldn’t you update a vehicle to the latest software if it’s sitting on your show room floor for weeks just looking pretty? It’s a 30 minute down load. Yet you will spend hours cleaning the vehicle and making sure the show room looks pristine and there is free coffee and biscuits?
If these vehicles are so complex and need so much software to make them do what they are designed to do, then surely the software needs to be shown the same respect and consideration as inflating the tyres correctly, or cleaning the wind screen so you can see pedestrians ahead of you clearly.
Joined
·
189 Posts
"If you create the environment where Dealerships don’t want to do anything at all without ‘approval’ from head office, this then leads to a culture of successive software updates not being done to the point that, beyond a certain software update that you haven’t downloaded, you then have to take the car to a service centre and lots of peoples time has to wasted. You also create the mind set that ‘it’s ok’ to sign off or sell a vehicle that’s is not ‘up to date’. "
This is somewhat of a bugbear of mine. If the software updates aren't done regularly then eventually the car will stop "communicating" with outside systems (ie charging points). That then requires a visit from Jag Assist, which is all well and good but if the car is out of warranty then that gets expensive. All because dealers are not routinely updating software at service times.
This is just not right. Breakdowns are being "engineered" into the system.
This is somewhat of a bugbear of mine. If the software updates aren't done regularly then eventually the car will stop "communicating" with outside systems (ie charging points). That then requires a visit from Jag Assist, which is all well and good but if the car is out of warranty then that gets expensive. All because dealers are not routinely updating software at service times.
This is just not right. Breakdowns are being "engineered" into the system.
Joined
·
200 Posts
Good morning Phil
You are 100% correct… JLR are engineering an issue at some future point in time.
It’s also worth considering and understanding that if you ask JLR for the software to be updated (with or without cause or need or fault) while under warranty, then should JLR choose not to do the software update, then when the warranty expires, you have good reason to not pay for it to done at a later time because you did ask them to do it at the correct time under warranty… and you have the email proof. Otherwise JLR could be seen to be engineering ‘income’ at a later date when in fact it should have been free under the warranty.
It’s also worth considering that companies will also switch tactics at the click of their fingers (or a lawyers advice) and say “you didn’t update the software… so it’s your own fault”.
Like Boeing blaming the pilots for not reading the memo that wasn’t sent out advising they had installed CFIT software onto the 737Max.
Joined
·
583 Posts
I was surprised my car was not updated when it was in service, I thought that was one of the service points. If they are afraid to update the car because it might break "something", it will for sure be expensive if the update fails outside warranty. Anyway I am on Touch Pro, do not expect any more updates soon......
Joined
·
200 Posts
I too thought they would update the software to 20.2 at it’s service but they did not. I think they know that updating the software could and has caused issues. One example of such an is that the TCU (Telematics unit) has had to be physical replaced at some software upgrades because it is faulty or of any old kind the doesn’t deal with the software well. Other customers with the same year car but a slightly different TCU had no issues.
Another issue with the TCU is that it can show ‘No software update available’ however I’ve been told that this can actually mean it’s not contacting the JLR server to check for a software update. Many have stated that they have had to take their car to the dealership because of this and some that the dealership reported they could not update the software because the TCU or even several TCUs were not working. This has led to many, including myself checking for a software update and thinking it’s all ‘up to date’ when it is not. I only found this out due to others on this site advising me so. Three weeks ago the dealer told me verbally at the service that it was “all up to date”.
By avoiding the Telematics update it avoids the issues with the TCUs. I bet you they’d offer to do the software update and any required work straight away if it was out of warranty and at the customers expense.
Joined
·
200 Posts
Hi Brendon
Thanks for replying. Yes there seems to be two schools of thought on this. One that it can be done by SOTA from 16.2 straight to 20.2 and one that it can not and has to go to the dealership. The dealership I spoke to in London told me it would have to come in. I don’t doubt you in any way though as others have said they managed to get updated to 19.2 via SOTA and then had to ask the dealership to push 20.2 but it was still via SOTA. I suspect that the TCU model/version may have something to do with which cars have to go in and which do not as many have mentioned TCUs having to be replaced.
Joined
·
189 Posts
I have just spoken with the dealership and they have stated that SOTA is enabled for my car but they will need the car to try and "push" the TCU updates. If the car can't/won't accept the updates then a replacement unit will be needed. Much the same message that others have had. Booked in for the end of the month.
Joined
·
200 Posts
Hi Phil
I was told the same…along with lots of other things. Eventually they pushed the software to the vehicle but, it still doesn’t seem to be looking for software.
Before you give them your car I would ask if the are prepared for the possibility that they may need a lot replace the TCU module. ie “Do you have any spare TCU modules ready for that scenario. A possible (most likely) answer is “No…we can only order it in once it’s broken (to save money).” Silly really when they know what the issue is, what could potentially happen and that it may take several attempts to fix.
I would also ask “If you can’t replace the TCU module the same day and are going to give me a loaner is it going to be a petrol/diesel?” The dealership that insisted I had to bring the car in said they “had no loaners for a month” and customer relations said “they (the dealerships) won’t have any TCU modules spare as they can only order them in when they need them and not before”.
…Just in Time… to waste the customers time and make you mistrust JLR.
Joined
·
200 Posts
…Could not say it better.
1 - 20 of 29 Posts
Join the discussion
