How clean is an EV?

The place to discuss everything else..
fa147
Posts: 1188
Joined: Thu Aug 08, 2019 1:25 pm
Location: London / United Kingdom

Re: How clean is an EV?

Post by fa147 » Sat Nov 16, 2019 2:22 am

Guys, I think these back-and-forth of exchanges are getting way too serious and you may start to miss the point of this forum.

We are here to primarily talk about the I-Pace but also speak about other topics which we may find interesting.

We don’t have to agree with each other’s points but we certainly should not be forcing our views on others and especially when they are not directly related to the main focus of the forum; the vehicle manufacturers by Jaguar and referee to as the I-Pace.

GDI - You don’t have to remark on the replies that you find annoying and disingenuous, they tend to go away by being ignored.

Chewy - You may have found a new calling, although you keep mentioning the electric XJ so I think you are still an EV advocate, but nonetheless, feel free to tell us about your calling (as long as it is related positively to the I-Pace) and please don’t try to force your view upon us.

I’m sure Rob would agree that people are welcome to the forum but they are equally welcome to leave the forum. Now we wouldn’t want that for any forum member as the forum would not exists without its members, but the forum is comprised of other members as well.
I-Pace MY20 HSE, Corris Grey, Ebony/Ebony Interior, 20” Grey & Diamond Turned, Panoramic Roof
S20C_20.43.1-618886 | Telematics: 16.2 | Map 08.030.0115.0153
Home Charging: Zappi 2.0 | I-Pace Member's Map: https://bit.ly/3cCU3Ei

SammyD
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Joined: Sat Oct 13, 2018 7:44 pm
Location: N.E Hampshire, UK

Re: How clean is an EV?

Post by SammyD » Sat Nov 16, 2019 8:19 am

and there is the use of leccy that is generated from your own PV array.
That is free from any grid contamination by those dirty Gas generated Electrons. I have such a setup. If I use the granny charger on a sunny day, ALL the charge I put into the Jag comes from my own source. Totally CO2 free. If you ask about the CO2 needed to build the panels then fine but I've had mine long enough to have paid off that bit of the equation.
It also messes up any overall CO2 costings for EV's that anyone can make.

If I know that there are more CO2 free electrons being put into the grid than I'm using I can drive without feeling any guilt whatsoever.
At the time I write this post 31% of the UK Leccy supply is from non CO2 generating sources. That (10GWh) is more than enough to charge all the EV's in the UK at the same time.
I also know that I'm done with Fossil fuels when it comes to cars.
When there is an Electric Bike that gives me 200miles of range, CCS charging and some decent aero then I'll get rid of my main use Motorcycle. I'll keep the two classic bikes I have but they don't do more than 100 miles a year so in the grand scheme of things, they are irrelevant.
I'll be going to the Motorcycle show at the NEC next Thursday or Friday to get a good look at what is on offer and in the pipeline.
Driving "Hirundo Rustica" since 15th Mar 2019. Lovely Jubbly :D :D
S20C since 11th Dec 2020 Maps : whatever is current/can be bothered to download

Delta5
Posts: 405
Joined: Tue Sep 24, 2019 1:32 pm
Location: Midlands

Re: How clean is an EV?

Post by Delta5 » Sat Nov 16, 2019 8:45 am

Chewy

The CO2 generated in the production of oil I’m sure is significant and adds to the carbon footprint but I don’t know by how much nor do I know if that is taken into account in the official CO2 emissions of an ICE, logic says that it is.

EVs

The average life cycle emissions of power production in the U.K. is around 400g/kWh (gas alone 450g) source Wikipedia 3 studies
I am going to assume that is including transmission losses, charging losses reported by Tesla users averages 15% IPace will be similar. DC charging will be similar the conversion from 3 phase mains still has to be done

The IPace will drive around 3mls/kw, taking that into account = 151g/mile

That is less than an XJ which is 149g/km - 270g/mile but it is way more than the 35g bandied about in previous posts.
As renewable increases that figure will gradually reduce close to Norway

I’m not knocking EVs they are the future but the real advance is renewable power, the more the better and as battery technology improves the restrictions on EVs will be much less.
IPace SE Caesium Blue, Ivory interior, Air suspension, 18in wheels, Drivers pack, 360. arrived 16th July, very nice.

Jelle v/d Meer
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Location: Tilburg / Netherlands

Re: How clean is an EV?

Post by Jelle v/d Meer » Sat Nov 16, 2019 9:41 am

An EV is ALWAYS cleaner because there is more to the equasion than CO2, there is a lot more bad stuff coming out of the tailpipes of ICE cars than CO2 and is all bad for environment and health.

Even if the total CO2 from production, usage to recycling is the same (which it certainly is not) EVs are better for our health and the environment.

In my personal case I know for certain that more than 50% of the energy my car consumes comes from Solarpanels. My own solarpanels produce 3100-3300kWh per year and I frequently use 50kW charger at local Lidl which has more than 10,000 Solarpanels on the roof.

Last point is that petrol/diesel are always polluting during production/distribution/consumption while with electricity the production/consumption will only get cleaner with time.
I-pace S + HUD + Drive Pack + Light Oyster Sport Seats + Tailgate I Ceasium Blue | 18" wheels
Infotainment 20C + Telematics 19.2 | ODO 64.367km | 2020 Efficiency 199watt/km @ avg 73km/h

******
Posts: 2283
Joined: Tue Oct 23, 2018 3:55 pm
Location: UK

Re: How clean is an EV?

Post by ****** » Sat Nov 16, 2019 9:57 am

This whole series of posts that started appearing on our EV forum just rubbed me up the wrong way. It did not come across as a genuine desire to open discussion but as one person’s desire to ram his (new) opinion down my throat. Prior to these posts he was extolling the virtues of EVs. The whole thing came across as thoroughly disingenuous and I found myself unable to resist responding. It was also turned into a personal matter by an attempt to publically shame me for choosing not to read his posts.

So anyone telling me just not to read them, please remember that half of you were responsible for posts shaming me and trying to force me to read them.

Anyway I won’t respond any more. This entire experience has soured the forums for me.

Enjoy your I-Paces and please please please don’t buy a diesel just because one person in the Internet thinks he knows better than just about every scientist on the planet.

fa147
Posts: 1188
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Location: London / United Kingdom

Re: How clean is an EV?

Post by fa147 » Sat Nov 16, 2019 10:25 am

Goshdarnit wrote:
Sat Nov 16, 2019 9:57 am
So anyone telling me just not to read them, please remember that half of you were responsible for posts shaming me and trying to force me to read them.
That’s true, and I was guilty of that but I thought Chewy had had a wobbler and realised maybe he’d gone too far and decided to mend his ways; maybe I was wrong, although I still think he is worth “saving”.

Anyway, how many posts (approx 2.3k) have you made on this forum and how much contribution? Why on earth would you let 10-15 posts tarnish that for you? The rest of us haven’t changed. Give it sometime and you’ll (hopefully) want to be back with full vigour, because the rest of us would want you to.
I-Pace MY20 HSE, Corris Grey, Ebony/Ebony Interior, 20” Grey & Diamond Turned, Panoramic Roof
S20C_20.43.1-618886 | Telematics: 16.2 | Map 08.030.0115.0153
Home Charging: Zappi 2.0 | I-Pace Member's Map: https://bit.ly/3cCU3Ei

malcolm
Posts: 323
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Location: kent

Re: How clean is an EV?

Post by malcolm » Sat Nov 16, 2019 10:38 am

Well said fa 147
I for one was definitely not trying to shame anyone into doing anything that they do not want to do, just tried to lighten the mood enough so everyone moved on, GDI and Chewy have both given great help, advice and information about the ownership of our Jag I-paces and that is what a huge part of this forum should be.
Yulong white HSE, 20" wheels, ebony and black pack
S19B_19.40.4-436082
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Delta5
Posts: 405
Joined: Tue Sep 24, 2019 1:32 pm
Location: Midlands

Re: How clean is an EV?

Post by Delta5 » Sat Nov 16, 2019 11:00 am

Jelle

I have considered the prospect of charging a EV using solar alone, a typical domestic with 4kw is probably going to take 2 days to charge a IPace and that is assuming full sun for long periods on summer, on overcast days it produced much less.
My own 30KW solar Panels connected to the grid averages year round less than 70Kwh per day so on an average day it could just about charge the car, on a sunny day maybe 3 hours, an overcast day in winter it would take several days.

An owner with space for a large solar array costing £25k plus could keep an EV charged but it would be much more economical to connect it to the grid and get any generation payments, then charging on demand in winter is more practical. As the grid profile moves towards renewable a personal solar system is less attractive, in 10 yrs time there will be little “green” advantage because most grid generators will already be nuclear or renewable
IPace SE Caesium Blue, Ivory interior, Air suspension, 18in wheels, Drivers pack, 360. arrived 16th July, very nice.

aquiss
Posts: 100
Joined: Sun Jul 21, 2019 3:36 pm
Location: Shropshire, United Kingdom

Re: How clean is an EV?

Post by aquiss » Sat Nov 16, 2019 11:36 am

I thought Chewy only the only day begged to be unblocked by Goshdarnit and also posted he was not going to post threads like, yet here I am reading more of it.

I came to these forums as a new owner of an I-Pace to talk to like minded owners, however, if this forum is going to be watered down with DERV and non EV related threads, I'll just stick to reading the I-Pace Facebook pages, because at least it's all on topic.

ricardon
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Re: How clean is an EV?

Post by ricardon » Sat Nov 16, 2019 3:18 pm

fa147 wrote:
Sat Nov 16, 2019 2:22 am
We are here to primarily talk about the I-Pace,..
+1.

My choice was made before I joined this forum and is based on my own personal requirements. I-Pace was and is still a very good fit for me.

My topics of interest on this forum are focused on the usage of the car and apps around it.

Sadly they are currently being drowned in all the other topics.
I-Pace HSE - Santorini Black - Tan Performance Interior - Black Exterior Pack - Pano roof - 20 inch - MY2020. Home country: BE. Delivery April 2019 - Infotainment 20B + Telematics 18.2 + H228/H264.

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