Chargegate

Forum for Jaguar Customer Relations
FENorway
Posts: 553
Joined: Tue Mar 20, 2018 8:06 am
Location: Norge

Chargegate

Post by FENorway » Wed Jul 03, 2019 10:05 am

In one month it is 1 year since the first I-Pace was delievered to customers.
Me and a lot of i-pace owners are sick and tired of waiting for comments and/or fixes for the fast charging issue Jaguar is facing.
1.Jaguar promised 0-80% in 40 minutes. (I see some web-pages now claims 0-80 in 45 minutes,but changing it is even more pathetic than ignoring it.)
In 40 minutes means an average of 101,6kw(84,7kwh battery) Invluded charge loss it needs more than 105kw to manage this. In 45 minutes average must be over 95kw.
2.Fact is that I-Pace is not able to charge at the required rate. Some got 60kw, most got around 80kw up to 50% SOC and some got 100kw for a short while before ramping down to 80 and tapering further down. All in all you will not get more than 60% extra SOC in 40 minutes. If you're Lucky.
All my reference here are with all available SW updates.
3.@CRC@jaguar. What are your plans about this. Is this as good as it gets? Will you i form us or will you continue to ignore us?
4.In Norway we had a large lawsuit against Tesla(which Tesla lost) because the car lacked some horsepowers. (even though it was as fast as Teslas claims) In my opinion the Jaguar Chargegate is far more serious than the above mentioned case.
5.I will strongly recommend Jaguar to come with a statement about this issue before a group of owners here in Norway takes this to the press. (EV related issues makes headline in Norway. This case will definitely also do) And next step will of course be a lawsuit. It is easy to prove that the usability is restricted because of the Chargegate.

I hope you take this issue seriously before we have to take step 2 or 3. A simply explanation og statement is more than enough to calm down thousands of owners.

I will also say that I am happy with other aspect of the car. Some SW issues, but otherwise the car is great. But if there was an alternative I would have sold it. (and bought an e-tron Sportback)

Best regards
FENorway
(Excuse my English, but I guess its better than your Norwegian.)
FE Corris grey light oyster/light oyster Performance 22" 5069 & 18" 1022 19B_19.40.4-436082 and 14.2


JohnGriff
Posts: 71
Joined: Wed Nov 21, 2018 4:23 pm
Location: Norway

Re: Chargegate

Post by JohnGriff » Fri Aug 16, 2019 12:33 pm

FENorway, have you had a reply from Jaguar regarding the issues that you wrote to them about? As an FYI my car an FE has been (stuck) at my local dealer since the 13th June. I got a battery error (not 12 volt) and the car couldn't be driven. Last week I was told the battery pack would be replaced and this was scheduled for the last week of August, which means it will have been broken for 12 weeks, assuming it actually gets fixed that week.

I emailed the dealer 4 weeks ago and requested that due to quality issues including lack of support for 100kW charging which after 3 SW updates still didn't provide what Jaguar said was supported, I demanded to return the car (Opphever Kjøpet). The reply I received was of course no way. When I had asked the service department for an update in July the answer I got was lack of personnel due to middle of the holiday period, too many cars towed in due to 12V battery problems and the last excuse, we have sold to many i-Pace's!!

I saw that a Tesla owner here in Norway has had his car stuck with Tesla for 100 days and tried to return the car, but Tesla refused. Not been able to find out what has happened since an article about his problems was published in one of the Norwegian Financial papers (DN). I am happy to talk more about next steps, as had I been fully aware of the charging issues, I would not have bought an i-Pace. Agree with you completely on "other aspects of the car".
FE Corris Grey 20" Delivered 14.10.18
IMC: S19B_19.40.4-436082
Telematics: 16.2
BCM Update August 2019


Chewy
Posts: 1904
Joined: Tue Nov 06, 2018 5:46 pm
Location: Forest of Dean. UK.

Re: Chargegate

Post by Chewy » Fri Aug 16, 2019 1:42 pm

I believe it will not be possible for Jaguar to demonstrate that the I-Pace is able to charge for 0% to 80% SoC in 40 minutes, even under laboratory conditions.

The INDICATED 100% SoC represents around 81kWh of capacity, with a new battery and ignoring battery degradation.

80% of 81kWh = 64.8kWh.

To achieve 64.8kWh in 40 minutes requires that an average charge level of 64.8 / 40 x 60 = 97.2kW.

Allowing for charge losses, this means the charger must delivery at >100kW for the entire 40 minutes, yet Jaguar state the charger has to only be 100kW capable. Theoretically this will be possible, and I would suggest that this is the figure picked on by the sales and marketing people with no reference to engineers at Jaguar. Jaguar has no control over the charger capability and should have made this clear.

Jaguar has fallen into the same trap that Nissan did with the advertised charging times for the 2018 Leaf.

People that purchase EVs tend to be much more interested and knowledgable about the technical matters of the vehicles they buy than a typical ICE purchaser. As such, specifications quoted will expect to to tested for correctness. Buyers will purchase an EV based on the information provided by the manufacturer in their advertising. If this information is wrong, then I would be confident the purchaser would have financial rights with regard to the purchase.


alk
Posts: 8
Joined: Thu Jan 31, 2019 10:37 pm
Location: Slemmestad/Norway
Contact:

Re: Chargegate

Post by alk » Wed Sep 11, 2019 9:46 pm

It's quite annoying going to the 150 kWh Ionity Chargers here in Norway paying 3.50 nok per minutt and getting only ~50 kWh charge. Just better to use the 50 kWh chargers besides them and pay 2.50 nok per minutt and face the wrath of the low kWh battery cars who gets angry since you are taking a spot when you could be using the 150 kWh one...
MY19 - I-PACE HSE FE - Corris Grey - 20"
InControl Touch Pro Software Version: S19A_19.24.2-375121 - Telematics Software Version: ??


Goshdarnit
Posts: 2283
Joined: Tue Oct 23, 2018 3:55 pm
Location: UK

Re: Chargegate

Post by Goshdarnit » Wed Sep 11, 2019 9:54 pm

alk wrote:
Wed Sep 11, 2019 9:46 pm
It's quite annoying going to the 150 kWh Ionity Chargers here in Norway paying 3.50 nok per minutt and getting only ~50 kWh charge. Just better to use the 50 kWh chargers besides them and pay 2.50 nok per minutt and face the wrath of the low kWh battery cars who gets angry since you are taking a spot when you could be using the 150 kWh one...
Unless you plug in with a very high state of charge you are really unlikely to get 50 kW or less from a 150 kW charger. On my recent test video, my car was receiving more than 50 all the way up to 80%. It won’t be getting 100 (I think we all realise that) but it was delivering 84 up to 50% and then slowly tapered after that. Even at 80% it was still receiving 53kw.

But if you’re above 50% when you plug in, it might be worth while plugging in to a 50 kW charger. But you’ll only be there for about 30-40 minutes to charge to 80-90% which Leaf owners can hardly moan about. In all honesty I’d probably still use the 150 were not talking a huge amount of money here at that point. Around 32kwh added to get from 50 to 90%. About 25 kWh if you go to 80. So about 25-30 nok. I think (not certain) that’s about £2?


FENorway
Posts: 553
Joined: Tue Mar 20, 2018 8:06 am
Location: Norge

Re: Chargegate

Post by FENorway » Wed Sep 11, 2019 10:09 pm

@Goshdamit I-Pace fast charging is crap. You can defend it as much as you like, but it don't take what Jaguar promised and compared to Audi and Tesla it is completely outdated.
FE Corris grey light oyster/light oyster Performance 22" 5069 & 18" 1022 19B_19.40.4-436082 and 14.2


alk
Posts: 8
Joined: Thu Jan 31, 2019 10:37 pm
Location: Slemmestad/Norway
Contact:

Re: Chargegate

Post by alk » Wed Sep 11, 2019 10:24 pm

Goshdarnit wrote:
Wed Sep 11, 2019 9:54 pm
Unless you plug in with a very high state of charge you are really unlikely to get 50 kW or less from a 150 kW charger. On my recent test video, my car was receiving more than 50 all the way up to 80%. It won’t be getting 100 (I think we all realise that) but it was delivering 84 up to 50% and then slowly tapered after that. Even at 80% it was still receiving 53kw.
It is a common issue here in Norway to not get a proper charge. But this time I entered with a 47% charge.. Charged for 15 minuttes - 12.7kWh - ended at 57% -- that should be roughly 50.8 kWh. After 15 min I had spent about 1€ more than I would on the charger besides it..

I have charged at Ionity chargers in Sweden and had a nice good curve before 100->84(32%)->75(59%)->48(77%) ...

The old good curve was with S19A_19.20.2-375121 - I have had a SOTA after.. cant find the version right now .. will update sig tomorrow
MY19 - I-PACE HSE FE - Corris Grey - 20"
InControl Touch Pro Software Version: S19A_19.24.2-375121 - Telematics Software Version: ??


Goshdarnit
Posts: 2283
Joined: Tue Oct 23, 2018 3:55 pm
Location: UK

Re: Chargegate

Post by Goshdarnit » Thu Sep 12, 2019 12:00 am

FENorway wrote:
Wed Sep 11, 2019 10:09 pm
@Goshdamit I-Pace fast charging is crap. You can defend it as much as you like, but it don't take what Jaguar promised and compared to Audi and Tesla it is completely outdated.
What? What the hell are you on about? Which part of that post was about defending Fast charging? Honestly, think before you post. I responded to a specific post and answered his points. Nothing was about “defending” anything. Get a life. Goodbye. Block list just got bigger.


fa147
Posts: 671
Joined: Thu Aug 08, 2019 1:25 pm
Location: London / United Kingdom

Re: Chargegate

Post by fa147 » Thu Sep 12, 2019 12:33 am

Goshdarnit wrote:
Thu Sep 12, 2019 12:00 am
FENorway wrote:
Wed Sep 11, 2019 10:09 pm
Let’s all calm down a little and stand back. I think there has been some confusion due to language exchange and it’s never a good thing to get into a forum argument. The goal of this forum is for its users to discuss issues, unearth facts, seek truths, reach knowledge and make progress.
I-Pace MY20 HSE, Corris Grey, Ebony/Ebony Interior, 20” Grey & Diamond Turned, Panoramic Roof
IMC: S19B_19.40.4-436082 | Telematics: 16.2 | Map 8.30.100.156


Goshdarnit
Posts: 2283
Joined: Tue Oct 23, 2018 3:55 pm
Location: UK

Re: Chargegate

Post by Goshdarnit » Thu Sep 12, 2019 1:02 am

fa147 wrote:
Thu Sep 12, 2019 12:33 am
Goshdarnit wrote:
Thu Sep 12, 2019 12:00 am
FENorway wrote:
Wed Sep 11, 2019 10:09 pm
Let’s all calm down a little and stand back. I think there has been some confusion due to language exchange and it’s never a good thing to get into a forum argument. The goal of this forum is for its users to discuss issues, unearth facts, seek truths, reach knowledge and make progress.
Trust me. I’m calm. He’s blocked. I won’t have to deal with him again. Easiest way to deal with that kind of thing in my experience. Life’s too short.


Post Reply

Return to “Jaguar Customer Relations”